Re: {Chrysler 300} coolant level down

On Tue, May 13, 2025 at 10:34 AM JIM KRAUSMANN <kraus300@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

John,

I feel your pain on the evaporator. Had failures on my Ram and GMC pickups. The trucks are built around the evaporators. I looked up the flat rates for replacements, 12-13 hours each. Wow, that must be a job. Still, I can do that and beat the times, he says naively. I did, but... cut, bruised, sore... had to be left eyed and right handed. Of some solace, I am told Corvette is worse.

How do evaporators (and lots of other parts) get that way... a guy in our morning coffee group is retired GM. His department oversaw assembly. Service, not considered. He says the only considerations in manufacturing is how easy and cheap it is to assemble. Nothing else. Another example, headlight and bulbs. There are remove and replace bumper jobs out there.

I got a refrigeration license 30 years ago. Never used it and forgot most, so no insight on leak detection. I see stop leak products in trade magazines for residential systems. My initial concern was plugging small openings, but there must be some value.

I used to be concerned about propane as a refrigerant for obvious reasons. Years later, I think what the heck. Why not. Comparatively, there are super high-pressure fuel components on gas and crazy battery issues with electric cars. Being close to Detroit, we hear about manufacturing problems. The fire department was constantly at one plant as they first learned how to assemble batteries. The packs would just go boom. The best was a fork lift driver who ran the forks into a pallet of battery components, then set it near other components. It took a dozen fire trucks and hours to put that one out. I hear they are much better at doing things now.

Jim Krausmann

05/13/2025 9:13 AM EDT John Grady <jkg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Great idea Henry ! On catch can type just reduce the psi .

I bet makes no difference. At all , in practice -as catch can will still catch it, too Comment on solder failure really good! I was thunking fatigue failure from flexing along with not 100% shiny clean when soldered

If you live where its 120 F maybe high psi needed . I bet not .

Different subject , = help! even more frustrating , AC freon leaks. Nothing more frustrating especially since Chrysler started using 8$ thin aluminum foil evaporators . On a Jeep GC you have to pull WHOLE dash out , And to do that the seat and console , steering wheel have to come out . I am an engineer, and I think a good one , I would have screamed at that design .

If embedding it ( dumb in first place) double the thickness not halve it to save 1$ . Moronic thinking by engineer in charge . Fire him. Welcome to recallville 3 k cost for them each car over saving a dollar, x 100,000 . And plastic blend door fitting that slips , again

2000-2500 of labor , 25$ parts . Some customers were hit twice .

So about 4th or 5 th time at this ( yes 300k miles.. amc six perfect) new evap 5 years agp.

So, Compressor failure . Jammed and burned up clutch .

New one in , really hard job , fan radiator edge , rad hoses , PS all in the way , down next to oil pan . still no AC , after more hassle found expansion valve stuck shut ( you get vacuum and high side ok) very tricky to figure out— crud from the compressor failure? ). New expansion valve , new dryer , but noticed it had lost its charge in interim

Replaced all that , lost charge again over a weekend .Cannot find specific leak , with a top end sniffer . Redid connections again , failed on vacuum test , over 24 hours. testing again now with propane based R134” equivalent” ( you cant get the real stuff anymore in small cans , says “ 6 oz Enviro tech “ R134 equivalent” to 16 oz of real 134 , that cannot be true ,you need so many oz (28) by weight. so ?3 of those cans to get 16 oz? 6x 20-30$ ! 6oz aspect carefully hidden . 6 oz???!!

What is in the can is 6 oz of propane ( note flammability warnings) about 75 cents worth for20-30 $ .All the brands same deal . Big brother ..

Have big tank of real stuff but use propane cans for test ? why not ,propane harmless

Anyway point of above anyone know secret sauce about finding a slow freon leak ?

I hate AC hassles . Max frustrating at every turn , set car on fire comes to mind

A product called AC pro gets rave reviews , also propane but has some kind of stop leak . Sorely tempted , aka radiator stop leak snake oil etc

Auugh

On May 13, 2025, at 12:35 AM, henry.schleimer@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

John raises a point about the pressure that a cap needs to hold in radiators designed to have an expansion tank on top rather than an overflow. This has always been a controversial topic but I’ll add my two cents worth in support.

When I got my 300C radiator re-cored I went to an expert with a lifetime of experience and who actually makes cores for vintage cars. Talking to him about my parents’ 67 Valiant with a similar radiator design, I bemoaned the fact the top of the tank split along the solder line three times over its 27 year life. He explained his thoughts. Older radiator tanks were wider than the core (to give it volume) but that meant the force trying to rip the seam (pressure x area) was about twice the modern narrower design putting greater stress on the solder. To make sure I never had this problem, he said to use a 7 psi cap, not the factory 14 psi. He said I won’t have a problem of losing coolant and I’ll never have to re-solder the top if the rest of the system is ok. As proof he said it was always the top tank that lifted, never the bottom, because the bottom tank was narrower (and less force on the solder).

I’m prepared to give it a go. Nothing to lose by trying and much to gain in reducing the stress on the tank, hoses etc. If I lose too much coolant too soon, I can always just increase the psi rating or just top it up more often.

I just recalled that my father just used plain water in the radiator back in the day, fifty years ago. So, I just looked up a chart and it shows that plain water will boil at 252 F under 16 psi pressure, but 60% coolant mix will boil at a similar 253 F under 8 psi. So, you can halve the radiator cap pressure for the same outcome (boiling) just by using coolant. Maybe the old “large” radiators were sized for the owners who didn’t bother with coolant? I wouldn’t try reducing the cap pressure on a modern car like John says as they don’t have a lot of coolant to spare increasing the chance of temperature spikes.

Cheers

Henry

From: chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> On Behalf Of John Grady
Sent: Tuesday, 13 May 2025 6:21 AM
To: dplotkin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: Hank Hallowell <Hank@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; ROBERT HAAG <scooter465@xxxxxxx>; Nick Taylor <nicksgaragesd@xxxxxxxxx>; Douglas James <jdd@xxxxxxxxxx>; Club International Chrysler <chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: {Chrysler 300} coolant level down

if you do overfill , especially if you keep doing it , it builds a lot of pressure that might not otherwise have happened — until the cap vents at rated psi . Especially after you shut it off , latent heat in heads may boil locally at exhaust valve . Its up near 240 there at normal pressure cap psi ( a function of that psi obviously )

But if a nice big air space the air compresses in air volume , pressure cannot rise enough to lift cap . Like expansion tank on your home heat.

In some ways better than catch bottle , they go to max pressure every time , spits out st max psi then draws back in , cycling all the hoses etc to 15+ psi in a modern car . That is all about smaller radiators , fewer rows running hotter to throw away same btu . Not a favor they did you!

Two anecdotes , bro in law, 2013 jeep hemi , new water pump , radiator , thermostat etc catch can design .

Constantly overheating , 3000$ dealer dance over a year + Still did it

Fed up . I have the car . Ed and I pressure tested ( thinking head gasket) to 18 psi . Ed saw a tiny jet of water coming out of a 1/2” plastic elbow where water goes into heater core under hood .

Had a longitudinal crack from new , at mold line , down one side . We cut off the elbow with hack saw put hose on straight, fixed! So every time he stopped pressure went up , this spit out then closed again . After a month overheat. Due to catch can design cycling .

#two : 67 Dart slant six on overnight ferry to Canada vacation , waiting in line to board , my “rebuilt “ radiator split at solder seam around tank ( be careful of this failure , bozo dirty solder workmanship under pretty black paint ) V8 radiator I put in , Puking out my coolant, hot day , Steam out of hood in the line i loosened cap slowed to trickle.

2000 mile trip no issue no rad pressure . At all Hmmm Temp fine

Did same thing in 1965 on 57 D500 dodge 325 , blown head gasket , made it thru winter , no $ to fix.

Steam re condenses in that air space

It’s a good thing!!!!!

On May 12, 2025, at 10:50 AM, dplotkin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

Perhaps I thought insufficiently about James problem. I assumed his rad level had been constant until recently which would cause me to think he is loosing coolant from a leak.

I would still pressure test the system to be sure. Costs nothing and will deliver peace of mind.

As mentioned by others all cars without expansion tanks must be allowed to find their own comfortable level. In my experience after any work done involving draining and refilling a cooling system it may take half a dozen or more long runs before the car is happy with its fill, all of it dependent on ambient temps.

This cycle is prolonged by overfilling each time she spits. A level just over the tubes would bother me, but its likely not the original rad the car came with, could have something to do with it.

Danny Plotkin

-----Original Message-----
From: "Hank Hallowell" <Hank@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2025 10:06am
To: "HAAG ROBERT" <scooter465@xxxxxxx>
Cc: "Taylor Nick" <nicksgaragesd@xxxxxxxxx>, "Douglas James" <jdd@xxxxxxxxxx>, "Chrysler Club International" <chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: {Chrysler 300} coolant level down

I want to chime in and completely concur with the self leveling comment made by Bob.

I have a bunch of these. Every winter I go thru check all of the fluid levels/change fluids/air pressure etc… every spring they all spit out what they don’t need - so I learned years ago- don’t sweat it as long as tubes are covered & the temp gauge is reading Ok. And even then every once in a while I drag out my old school meat thermometer and double check the temperature gauge if I’m suspicious.

Hank

On May 12, 2025, at 8:02 AM, ROBERT HAAG <scooter465@xxxxxxx> wrote:

Self leveling

Needs room to expand when hot.

That's why they added the

Coolant recovery system

In 1973 on all models.

Bob Haag

On May 11, 2025, at 11:28 PM, Nick Taylor <nicksgaragesd@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

My 300F acts the same way. It wants to be about a quarter inch over the tubes when cold. Any more than that it will push out the extra when I stop. Done it at cruise nights and car shows more than once. The car never runs hot.

On Sun, May 11, 2025, 2:05 PM 'James Douglas' via Chrysler 300 Club International <chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On my 64, the radiator coolant level seems to drop to hear the bottom of the upper tank. No leak in the radiator or anyplace else I can find. I noted that it seems to push water out the overflow after a long hour freeway run. I am used to this in my cars without overflow containers, but never this much.

Is it possible that the pressure cap is not doing its job. Anyone having issues with the pressure caps?

James

--
For archives go to http://www.forwardlook.net/300-archive/search.htm#querylang
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Chrysler 300 Club International" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to chrysler-300-club-international+unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/chrysler-300-club-international/CY5PR19MB617197764AF4E0C53BA8DC5A9394A%40CY5PR19MB6171.namprd19.prod.outlook.com.

--
For archives go to http://www.forwardlook.net/300-archive/search.htm#querylang
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Chrysler 300 Club International" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to chrysler-300-club-international+unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/chrysler-300-club-international/CA%2BjApFOa9gpTzZmeFgqQCtLgGzQG112fLoiJ%2BjA5G7YDhyCDNQ%40mail.gmail.com.

--
For archives go to http://www.forwardlook.net/300-archive/search.htm#querylang
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Chrysler 300 Club International" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to chrysler-300-club-international+unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/chrysler-300-club-international/CE30E74D-D0B7-494F-B74F-96B0381B22A5%40cox.net.

--
For archives go to http://www.forwardlook.net/300-archive/search.htm#querylang
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Chrysler 300 Club International" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to chrysler-300-club-international+unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/chrysler-300-club-international/0C1145EC-7455-46A7-89AE-70B2CD3CE929%40hallowellbrooks.com.

--
For archives go to http://www.forwardlook.net/300-archive/search.htm#querylang
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Chrysler 300 Club International" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to chrysler-300-club-international+unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/chrysler-300-club-international/1747061436.771727616%40apps.rackspace.com.

--
For archives go to http://www.forwardlook.net/300-archive/search.htm#querylang
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Chrysler 300 Club International" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to chrysler-300-club-international+unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/chrysler-300-club-international/6724F703-B9CC-4E31-AF81-7A7E78A76DC2%40gradyresearch.com.

--
For archives go to http://www.forwardlook.net/300-archive/search.htm#querylang
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Chrysler 300 Club International" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to chrysler-300-club-international+unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/chrysler-300-club-international/1E8A0911-F90C-45FD-A76A-F932AE03A9DB%40gradyresearch.com.